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Initial Velo Routier Notes

03 Monday Mar 2014

Posted by Brian Hanson in Cycling

≈ 15 Comments

Tags

4130, a. homer hilsen, B&M Luxos, bar-end shifters, Berthoud, bike commute, Boxy Rando, Cycles Toussaint, cypres, double butted, Gran Bois, Hetre, low-trail, nitto, noodles, planing, randonneur, Rawland, rene herse, rivendell, rSogn, shimmy, SPD, Velo Routier


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I’ve been riding the Cycles Toussaint Velo Routier for a few days – have about 50 miles on it so far.  I wanted to collect my thoughts as this is a new geometry and tire size for me.  As for the rest of it, it’s very similar in size, weight, and materials (steel) to my A. Homer Hilsen.  I’ve used a nearly identical build for the bikes, as well.  Both have Nitto Noodle 41cm bars wrapped in cotton tape, both have the Rene Herse cranks, and both are within a few millimeters of dimension for fit.  the main difference is the wheel size, tires, and geometry with the Velo Routier being a “low trail” and the Hilsen a “mid-trail” ride.  OK – getting to the gut reaction first.

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The Hetres really smooth out the ride on my rather bumpy commute.  Although I’m on bike trails most of the time, my commute has a number of rough spots with roots pushing up the pavement on the trail, as well as general poor road maintenance in other spots.  The Hetres feel smoother as you would expect.  They have more air volume, and I have them pumped to 40psi rear, 30psi front.  Comparing this to the Cypres tires on the Hilsen at 65psi rear and 45psi front, it should be more forgiving.

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The bike feels just as fast.  This is gut, so I will watch my commute stats over a longer timeframe.  The first few rides are inconclusive as I’ve been more tired than usual. The ride times between bikes are within a few minutes out of an hour commute home.

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I can really feel the handling differences in the low-trail – and it is not as disruptive as some of the lit I’ve read.  The closest analogy I’ve heard is that “you steer with your bars” on the low-trail bike, whereas  on the Rivendells, you “steer with your hips”.  This seems accurate to me.  I can ride this bike no-handed.  It’s not easier to do this than the Rivendell – if anything it is just slightly more apt to wander around, but this may just be my lack of experience on this type of geometry.  The interesting part is the feel with a front load.  It is much more planted with a bag and a few pounds up front.  It also wanders less when going slow, and of course there is much less issue with wheel flop when the bike is stationary.  The ride feel is subjectively better with this setup for me.  I really like having a front rando bag for longer rides.  I can do nearly everything I need to do with all the gear within easy reach.  This all said, I was doing fine with the Hilsen and the front rando.  I just feel that the Toussaint “feels” more planted with this setup while riding.

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As I said earlier, the Hilsen and Velo Routier are set up proportionally identical for my fit.  Both bikes feel like a good steel bike should.  Solid, compliant, light enough.  Both are also beautiful in their own way.  The Hilsen will win this battle, but the Toussaint is very nice looking in white with stainless Berthoud fenders and subtle red/yellow decals.

BH-3.jpg

I haven’t had any shimmy issues with either bike.  The Velo Routier tracked like a steam engine on a 30+ mph descent, and I rode shimmy-free no-handed from 15-25 mph.  This seems to be the sweet spot for shimmy.  I know the tubing on the Toussaint is double-butted 4130, with  .9/.6/.9 top, seat, and down tubes on my size “large” frame.  The smaller sizes are .8/.5/.8.  This is not the “ultra-light” planing grade tubing that Jan Heine tends to like, and some of the Rawland bikes are built to, but I’ve ridden an rSogn, and it felt as stiff as this frame.  Perhaps I need more sensitivity training.  In any case, it rides really well, and I feel totally comfortable on this bike.  A longer test ride is due, and luckily this is all set and ready for the upcoming brevet season starting next week!

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Other comments on the build?  I had no problems getting the build done – there were no flukey gonzo issues like misalignments, or gummed up threads.  The hanger was straight, the fenders were already mounted, as were the brakes.  I ended up tightening up the fender alignment to match up the Hetres as it originally had 38mm Somas on it, but that was the biggest time suck.  I honestly had the thing built in a few hours, and I was taking my time.  It helped that I had a cockpit set up from a previous build – nice not to have to wrap the bars.  One note – I originally had SPD pedals, but put VP flats on it for the beginning of the season.  I want to try these on longer rides to see if I have a knee issue that bothered me last year with the clipless pedals.  I also migrated the 9-speed cassette and downtube shifters back to an 8-speed setup with bar-end shifters.  Oh, I also put the B&M Luxos dyno light on this bike for the season.

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One more item I forgot to add – I was very worried about what kind of front rack to use.  The center-pull Dia Compe 750 brakes leave very little room and the normal rando-standard Nitto Mini rack wouldn’t work.  Luckily, Cycles Toussaint has this figured out.  They have a special rack made just for this bike.  I exchanged emails (actually, blog comments) with Evan at Cycles Toussaint, and ordered it after I got the frame.   It arrived a few days later just in time for my build.  It fit perfectly with rear mounts that fit to the fork crown mounting screws.  The rack holds my Tall Boxy Rando bag from Acorn at just the right height – the top even with my bars.  Super happy with this.  It is also possible to saw the rear arms off, bend the lower support arms, and mount the rack to the fender at two points if you want a lower platform and a more “constructeur” touch as Evan did with his personal bike.

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Now it’s time to put some miles on this guy (and try not to forget my other bikes in the process).

RidgeRunner Porteur

14 Tuesday Jan 2014

Posted by Brian Hanson in Cycling

≈ 1 Comment

Tags

bike cockpits, commute, fog, Miyata, nitto, RidgeRunner Team, Seattle, Soma Grand Randonneur, Technomics


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RidgeRunner Porteur, a set on Flickr.

I promised some photos of the re-cockpitted Miyata, and it was light out when I rode in today. It was a nice misty day by the time I got downtown.  The fog started as I neared the Sound, and I was covered in wet mist by the time I got to work. Another beautiful Seattle commute!

Comments on the setup:

  • I love the way this bike rides, but it’s time to disassemble in anticipation of the forthcoming Soma Grand Randonneur.
  • I may keep the frame, but I have a feeling it won’t get ridden much.
  • The bottom bracket is too high, which pushes the seat too high – too much seatpost showing.
  • I would also put a longer stem on this beast – probably a Nitto Technomics 110.
  • The reach is a bit too short this way.
  • I also won’t do 175mm cranks again. After 170/171s it feels like I’m really moving the legs a lot!

More Diamonds on an Albatross

29 Wednesday May 2013

Posted by Brian Hanson in Cycling

≈ Leave a comment

Tags

albatross, cotton tape, harlequin wrap, Newbaum's, nitto


I did another diamond (harlequin) tape wrap on my Hunqapillar with Albatross bars.  I’m liking the gray and maroon cotton Newbaums tape as a match for the bike.  I will eventually put clear shellac and darken the gray tape a bit, but for now, I’m enjoying the raw cotton feel.  Here are some pics from the process:

Half-done

Cat’s view

With Dog

6 per side

 

Grip with Cork Underneath

Forward Grip Curves

 

 

 

 

Albatross Bar Conversion

23 Thursday May 2013

Posted by Brian Hanson in Cycling

≈ 2 Comments

Tags

albatross, bike bags, bike basket, bike commuting, commuting, country bike, Hunqapillar, midge, nitto, rambler, rivendell, truck


Back when I was riding a mountain bike to work regularly, I bought Albatross bars to get a more upright position.  While I enjoyed the wide range of positions for my hands, the one issue I had was a lesser ability to get “aero” when it was windy.  In my rambling experiments, these fell out of fashion after a time and I moved on to drops.

Original Albas

I recently revived the bars when I wanted to get my camp bike set up for an upcoming Seattle/Portland Riv Ramble that will be happening near the halfway point of Packwood, WA.  I started the conversion away from the road-friendly Nitto Noodles to the more dirt oriented Midge bars.  They seemed to be too much of a compromise in that they didn’t offer the feel of drops with the big vertical differences, and didn’t have an “upright” position.

Midge Conversion

The Albatross bars are all about upright, but also flare forward of the stem for a stretched position.  There is also the near-stem narrow position that gets one in a nice aero setup, as well.  I had an older mountain bike stem from a ’92 Stumpjumper Pro that had enough reach to push the Albatross bars out far enough to get that aero position I need for the windy days, as well as enabling me to extend the bar ends back even more with bar end shifters.  Here’s what it looks like:

Albatross with long stem

I got a chance this week to test the wind theory, with a couple commutes.  May is a great month for me as the wind often shifts mid-day giving me headwinds both ways.  Using the inner hand position, I was able to get a nice aero tuck on the bike.  Holding the forward curves also kept me out of the wind, and if I bent my elbows, I could get nearly as aero as on drop bars.  The leverage from 56cm bars is another great benefit of these bars.

Bars from the back

Riding with Albas may even be safer on a commute.  For example, I take a route that runs downhill on a busy arterial on the way into work, and often cars are backed up across intersections. There is constant danger of cars/bikes/people crossing in front of me between stopped traffic.  I noticed right away that riding upright affords a much better view of traffic and potential collision fodder.  Side benefit or primary if you’re a safety hound…

Bagger

OK – I’m not fooling myself, part of why I like this setup is that it is the configuration of the Riv video that originally piqued my interest in the Hunqapillar, and it gives the bike a different, more specific setup than my other bikes.  It really is a country rambler, camp/tour bike now with the capacity to be a great commuting “truck” when I need/want to carry a lot of cargo.  As it is a stiffer bike than the Homer, it feels both heavier, and more solid when carrying loads.  That’s great if I’m not tired out, but I’ll have to evaluate it after a couple days of touring around in the hills.

 

 

Drop Some Wisdom

17 Sunday Mar 2013

Posted by Brian Hanson in Cycling

≈ Leave a comment

Tags

200k, cork tape, cotton bar tape, drop bars, hand comfort, nitto, Nitto B-115, nitto noodles, noodles, Olympiade, populaire, porteur, randonneur, ride comfort, rivendell, VO


When I started riding road bikes again around 2009, I read a lot of opinion on the “internets”, and a few things were spoken of as gospel.  One of these was:

  • Drop bars, in particular Noodle bars are great for long term comfort (Discussion Thread from ’09)

I’m a dedicated experimenter/tweaker when it comes to building and riding bikes.  I had been on road bikes with drop bars for a short period of my life from about 1983-1991, but mainly as a part-time commuter.  I never raced, and only did one 2-day 150 mile ride in high school.

My old road bike – Raleigh Reliant

When I moved to Seattle in 1991, I rode a friend’s mountain bike down some fire  trails in Whistler, BC, and was totally smitten.  From then until 2009, I had various mountain bikes with flat bars.  When I bought my first Rivendell, I tried 46cm Noodles, but found them uncomfortable.  Specifically, when I was in the drops, they felt really deep/extreme, and my forearms hit the tops disconcertingly.  There was something off.

Cupcake and Homer with 46cm Noodles

I found VO Porteur bars to be a better fit for me initially, as they had a nice stretched-out thin position on the flat fronts, and I could also get very upright on the swept back part of the bars.  I went through a few iterations with these bars until I started riding in longer Randonneur events.  On one Populaire, I developed a bit of numbness in one hand at the 50-mile mark, even with soft cork tape.  I was definitely the only rider using upright bars of any kind, and most of  the folks were using drop bars of some sort.

Porteur with Cork and Cotton

I decided that I would have to try some drops for the longer 200k ride I had planned.  I had an older pair of Nitto B-115 Olympiade bars from the 80s, and the width was a tiny 39cm (compared to the 46cm).  I set these guys up, and found them comfortable on my commute (7-12 miles each way). I also found that my forearms didn’t hit the tops of the bars when I was in the drops.  The next test was the Bellingham 200k.

Olympiades

At the end of the event, I had no hand discomfort, and felt that the bars were close to ideal.  They just needed more width, and a bit of curve back like the old noodles had on the tops.  This led me back to the beginning (almost) and the Noodle style I started out with.  I went with the next bigger size of Noodles and have not gone back to uprights.

Sometimes it is best to listen to the wisdom/opinion of experienced riders in the first place.  At least cheaper…

Faves! Nitto Noodle 42cm with SRAM S500 Levers

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